Spares prices...

[Jay.Watson]

First off, this is a genuine question and not designed to start a fight or have a go...

I'm a newbie to Ariels and and a returnee to Brit' bikes after years of big Jap's and Harleys - I sold my Devimead modded '69 Thunderbolt for £500 so hopefully you'll see where I'm coming from on this.

When I posted pic's of my '55 VH500 in members' bikes I was advised that the head was the wrong one. This didn't particularly concern me at the time but I have since found all the rocker box threads to need renewing due to a previous mullering. Before sending the head for repair I thought I'd search around for another one. Lo and behold, one on eBay just up the road! The starting bid is set at £650.00 - I contacted the seller and asked if this was a mistake and was informed that it was correct. Is this a realistic price for a used head that requires a little work?
I have no intention of buying it as I have found a local company that can repair mine, I just wondered how out of touch with prices I am!

[John.Newbury]

John Budgen has new heads for £625 (not sure if that's plus VAT), Draganfly sometimes have used ones, worth checking, The last used NH head I bought from them was £60 + VAT and postage and in excellent condition. I think given all that is wrong with the ebay head it is well over the top price wise and I have noted for a while it has been relisted many times - no takers!

[adrie.degraaff]

I would say 200 to 400 pounds depending what the condition is.

The above compare is not good, they all want "push in" heads for HT's, these are made new, 1955 is "push out" thus less wanted.

VHA has fine threads wich breakout easy, the buyer of the ebay VHA will pay you the same price as the 1955 up the road.

[Keith.owen]

Sadly it is a fact of life that for these old machines spares are either, used, new old stock or patterns.

The fact that patterns have to be manufactued in small quantities plus a load of other factors means that they are expensive (i.e. John Budgens heads which are re-manufactured). You can get stuff made in India but then you should accept that it will probably have to be fettled before it will fit. This is just the name of the game.
In any case the price of patterns sets the price for everything else (used or NOS).

Concerning Jay's position I'm sure the fact that the head isn't quite the correct one only really matters (dare I say) if it matters to him. My bike has a 1949 timing chest not the correct 1950 (because the rocker feed stud is 3/16 and 1/4 inch - or something like that) and a 1953 barrel ('cause it has a thin flange and takes a gasket). It took me thirty odd years to find this out and does it upset me - no!

I'm also sure that if you have cotton covered wire and not PVC insulated the elctrons will flow at 186,000 miles/s and not 330,000 km/s (sorry, got this wrong - speed of electrons is affected by the properties of the conductor and not the insulation).

Jay, get the threads helicoiled and just enjoy your bike! If you really want to change the head then just keep looking and one day I'm sure you'll get lucky.

Keith

[john.mitchell]

The reason that Alloy 500cc heads are in such short is that there are more literally hundreds more HTs in existence than ever were made by Ariel. For a long time it was possible to obtain all the parts necessary to build an HT from scratch except for the head. So of course the slightly less desirable complete VH motors still around became donors. Fortunately a couple of firms took on the job of reproducing the heads but it was an expensive business and the price of a good original head now approaches the price of a newly manufactured one.
Regarding originality I have a 1939 (ish) Red Hunter and I sometimes ask members to tell me what is not correct about it. I think there are about 20 incorrect parts that I know of. But it goes really well and like Rhett Butler, I just don't give a damn...

[Jay.Watson]

Keith - agree entirely. I'm not concerned with the head being the wrong one as such, just thought whilst it was off and needing work would be a good time to replace with a good example of the correct type if any were about. Having not looked at the prices of this sort of stuff for about ten years I was a little surprised at the asking price for a head that needed work, it hadn't occured to me that new ones even existed nowadays - the British biker is better catered for now than when I last dabbled.
As for my particular problem, a local firm can weld up the head for about £40 leaving me to drill and re-tap - unfortunately Helicoils and Time-serts are a no go due to a certain amount of "engineering" by a previous owner.

[Jay.Watson]

John - thanks, that goes a long way to explaining the situation. Much like Gold Star, Mini Cooper and Sunbeam Tiger then...

[robjameson]

Jay,

The head you are referring to on eBay has been relisted weekly for about six months, the seller is also asking silly money for a fully enclosed rear chaincase - I think he is a bit of a dreamer, but unfortunately, if he leaves it on long enough, someone desperate enough will pay it and drive all the prices up!

I seem to remember selling an alloy head at the AGM about 3 years ago for (i think) £250 - it wasn't perfect.

[nevhunter]

Market forces (supply and demand) is what is at play. One high price is just that. It might encourage some to fly kites, but at the end of the day supply dictates what is paid. IF the demand is there someone may make the parts. When the bikes were new a new cyl head would have been a fair bit of money, so most would have been repaired (as they are now). manufacturing new parts for a small market is a precarious business and we should support this as it is all you have. (The stuff hasn't been made for more than 50 years)
IF you have a bike which has some wrong parts but runs safely and well, enjoy it. This doesn't mean that those who strive for absolute authenticity should be made feel uncomfortable either.
An absolutely original good condition bike should always be the "peak' of what is desired. Restored can sometimes be "overrestored" but again that may be the wish of the owner, especially one who is doing it for the first time. My bikes are put together to be used ( but not abused as they are not made any more) Nev.

[Keith.owen]

Nev,
I think there exists a general consensus among us. I concur with your perspective on this!

keith