48 Ariel 500 Twin - Primary Oil Seal

Singles, twins and fours.
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LeeW
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48 Ariel 500 Twin - Primary Oil Seal

Post by LeeW »

Hi All,

Have a 48 Ariel 500 Twin Field Master I am attempting to get a "semi" oil tight primary on and have some queries.

Crank Seal: The old Crank Oil Seal was rock hard and have sourced replacement parts from Draganfly. My question is this seal doesn't appear to be retained to the inner primary at all? I can see the old seal has been spinning with the crank marring the inner primary and I don't see any way that it was previously retained? What am I missing here?

Gearbox Seal This old seal "I assume not factory" was "Fit" to the inner primary however the inner primary has a taper, what should be here?

Links to Images here:

Crank Seal 1
Crank Seal 2
Crank Seal 3
Crank Seal 4
Crank Seal 5
Gearbox Seal 1
Gearbox Seal 2
Gearbox Seal 3

Cheers
will_curry
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Re: 48 Ariel 500 Twin - Primary Oil Seal

Post by will_curry »

The crankshaft seal isn't retained to the case. It relies on a degree of compression between
the sprocket and the case to hold the oil in the crankcase.

In my experience with my Square Four it works quite well.

With regard to the sealing the gearbox shaft, the oil should be retained by the cast-in
flange on the chaincase. Again, my experience is that this works well iunless the
flange has been damaged. There is a similar but larger flange on the outer case
keeping oil out of the clutch.
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paul.jameson
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Re: 48 Ariel 500 Twin - Primary Oil Seal

Post by paul.jameson »

Hello Lee and welcome to the Forum. I think your problem is down to having a primary chaincase inner from a single rather than a twin. To confirm this, can you post a photo of the top of the chaincase inner where it meets the engine please? There should be quite a kick in the line of the top of a twin chaincase inner which is absent on the singles type.
Goodness knows what the gearbox seal was about but something like that was never fitted to Ariels
Paul Jameson
35 LG (project), 36 4G, 37 VH, 54 KH(A), 75 Healey 1000/4, 52/53 ex ISDT KHA (project).
Former Machine Registrar & Archivist, General Secretary and Single Spares Organiser (over a 25 year period).
Now Archivist once more - but not Machine Registrar.
LeeW
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Re: 48 Ariel 500 Twin - Primary Oil Seal

Post by LeeW »

Thanks guy's, looks like its correct then and someone has just done their best with that gearbox seal....

Photos below of inner, looks like it mite be correct

https://drive.google.com/file/d/1WJV764 ... share_link
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1WS3Rmp ... share_link
https://drive.google.com/file/d/1WTf1Uf ... share_link
LeeW
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Re: 48 Ariel 500 Twin - Primary Oil Seal

Post by LeeW »

will_curry wrote: Thu Nov 24, 2022 3:22 pm The crankshaft seal isn't retained to the case. It relies on a degree of compression between
the sprocket and the case to hold the oil in the crankcase.

In my experience with my Square Four it works quite well.

With regard to the sealing the gearbox shaft, the oil should be retained by the cast-in
flange on the chaincase. Again, my experience is that this works well iunless the
flange has been damaged. There is a similar but larger flange on the outer case
keeping oil out of the clutch.
As I can see evidence of the previous seal spinning against the inner primary, would it hurt to put a little RTV between seal and case on this one? or is that a no no

Cheers
will_curry
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Re: 48 Ariel 500 Twin - Primary Oil Seal

Post by will_curry »

There's nothing in the design to suggest to me that the seal should be fixed to anything.

The Square Four has a pen steel washer between the seal and the crank case and both
were well polished the last time I looked.

I'm not a fan of RTV so I wouldn't bother with it.

What I would do is make sure that the small screw inside the primary case at 3 'clock to the
crank can't come out because if it does it will cause some serious damage.

I looked in the parts list for the early twins and I couldn't find the oil seal listed although it
is listed for later models. There was some changes made to the sprocket and shock absorber
over the years and I'm not at all sure what the differences are.
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paul.jameson
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Re: 48 Ariel 500 Twin - Primary Oil Seal

Post by paul.jameson »

I can't access the photos of the primary inner, not having access to the google thing the links demand. Can you post the photos on the Forum please? You need to click on the attachments tab below when writing the message, then click on add files and follow the instructions.
Paul Jameson
35 LG (project), 36 4G, 37 VH, 54 KH(A), 75 Healey 1000/4, 52/53 ex ISDT KHA (project).
Former Machine Registrar & Archivist, General Secretary and Single Spares Organiser (over a 25 year period).
Now Archivist once more - but not Machine Registrar.
LeeW
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Re: 48 Ariel 500 Twin - Primary Oil Seal

Post by LeeW »

Primary Inner Photos.

Cheers
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